1st time buyer B10 V8 - Pre-purchase inspection, Insurance

MrD · Post by **MrD** » Fri Feb 08, 2013 1:09 pm

Hello All,
Have been lurking for the past few weeks, and really getting quite interested in the Alpina way of doing things. This seems to be about getting the best of both performance and comfort, which for most manufacturers seems to be mutually exclusive. All wrapped up in a luxurious, somewhat subdued package and built to last - very German, very appealing.
So, now I've found 1 or 2 vehicles which suit my modest means, I'd like to make approaches armed with the right kind of questions and knowledge, which is where the Aplina community on here seems to be so helpful

The car in question is a B10 V8 around 100,000m. What might I expect to have to repair/replace for that vintage? Suspension seems to be a particular focus of these cars, is it durable? Or consumable? Cooling system, exhausts, brakes, head gasket? It seems these engines, correctly maintained, will last forever, what is the boards view? I expect the electrics to be working w/o complaint, otherwise the vendor would be asked to rectify.

Pre-Purchase Inspection
Considering Synters, Nottingham, assuming they offer such a service. Is that the best option? Also found:
http://www.vehicleengineerassessors.co.uk in Lancs,
http://www.inspectacar.net in Wirral,
http://www.carinspections.co.uk/ in Stamford... really I'm looking for a recommendation. Is there such a thing as an Alpina specialist?
I think I need this expert view in support of my own judgement as the costs of repair/renovation can be a bit astronomical - I don't intend making insulting offers on the back of the PPI. It's an old car so some wear and tear is to be expected but I would like to know the potential for costs in advance.

Insurance
Tried Parkers and Moneysavingexpert for some quick qoutes from the typical players. Best was ~Â£500 but that was a Â£900 excess, the rest were in the Â£800-Â£1k mark, which is a bit strong.
41yrs old, 6+yrs NCD, 6pts which will expire in 2013, 2x recent claims 1x windscreen & 1xvandalism, 1 add'l named driver, rural Notts - what I'm saying is, I'd have hoped for a better price, am I wrong?

Sorry for the long 1st post but frankly there's a lot at stake, but I think it's worth the legwork

Many thanks.

BarryM · Post by **BarryM** » Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:58 pm

Well as I was in your position just 12 months ago I reckon I can offer some advice - which will undoubtedly be added to by others.

As you say given the age you'll have to expect some work along the way but the real key is to look at the car in conjunction with whatever service history is present, if buying privately you'd expect plenty of paperwork to back it up and I always go and check with dealers as well to verify they did actually service the car.

I'm sure you've read about the choices and I went for a facelift model on the basis it's newer and many people who buy pre-facelift then spend money adding the facelift options.

My car had 102,000m on it and had been fully serviced, however I do have a squeak at the front which I guess is suspension related and just doing regular maintenance such as oil, plugs etc does add up. Then think about a gearbox oil change, any cooling parts (my expansion bottle just went) which cost Â£200 to do myself by the time I'd purchased a few related parts. The wheels will probably need a refurb and one of mine cracked so that was another Â£200 to repair (including a s/h tyre).

Insurance - I got a good price with Admiral and by adding my wife it got even cheaper, if I remember rightly it was even cheaper when i said it wasn't garaged..

Overall I'm delighted I made the leap but do expect ongoing costs even though I only use it at weekends, all in all I'd say do it - just take your time as there are always a few on offer

MrD · Post by **MrD** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:29 am

Thanks for the input Barry and I take on board the importance of records which prove the care and maintenance. Checking back w/ dealers is reputedly difficult, but I'll cross that bridge when I can.

My choices were more in line w/ budget and availability to be honest, so I'll take my chances w/ pre- or post- facelift

You can repair a cracked wheel? Who knew?!

I was intending to use as a daily driver - I don't think that's unrealistic?

Did you do your own investigation before buying, was it a private sale, did you obtain and use a dealer warranty?

Thanks again, M.

BarryM · Post by **BarryM** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:04 am

I'll try and answer each point!

I'm not a regular car buyer but with both Alpina and my previous BM I rang dealers to verify they'd serviced the cars (I even managed to contact a previous owner via an independent which really helped). I turned down a couple of cars years ago because the dealer hadn't seen the BMs even though the owners told me who'd serviced them....You should find most Alpinas have loads of good history (well they're the ones to choose)!

Cracked rims happen and with roads getting worse they'll continue to happen, I have 19s and wince every time I hit a big pothole, plenty of info about refurbs and repairs if you search on here.

Daily driver, hmm - probably depends on mileage and if you'll be maintaining it yourself. With a V8 you'll be lucky to see 25mpg and that will be driving it like an OAP, if you want to enjoy the engine then I'd say around 20mpg is more realistic. I think you'll find most B10 owners are multiple car owners and some on here don't seem to do many miles each year

I'm reasonably handy with a spanner but mainly on motorbikes so took a mate along to give me some support when checking out my car, however I did have some help from a very friendly B10 owner on here who popped along and gave me some very good info before I made the 200 mile trip to look myself (I'd already made phone calls to get service history and done my dealer checks by then). Bought the B10 from a small car dealer and based on age I didn't expect much in the way of a warranty as I thought I'd identified any problems I might run into.

It will cost more than you think if you want to keep it in good nick but definitely worth the effort. I'm surprised no-one else has chimed in but maybe all the other B10 owners are out in their garages

paulbraden2010 · Post by **paulbraden2010** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:58 am

Hi

When I bought my B10, I had mine inspected by the dealership, it costs Â£200, but it is a top to bottom insection, which highlighted the diff seals on mine. These were then replaced.
Other thing to budget is, new thermostat, water pump, belts and viscous fan. Other thing to watch with the V8 is that the alternator is water cooled, and is about Â£700 alone for the part!
HTH

jamesa · Post by **jamesa** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:49 pm

When considering my V8 I spent a lot of time researching this forum, this revealed many of the `standard` issues that these cars suffer and which an inspection would / may not reveal.

I then used said info to great effect when searching out a car, checking the service / repair history and speaking with the owner.

The combination of an extremely enthusiastic owner and a detailed advert / history gave me the confidence to view without a `formal` inspection ... I was not disappointed

Mileage was 141k on purchase and up to 151k within nine months.

http://thealpinaregister.com/forums/vie ... sc&start=0

I insure with Aviva via a broker.

Good luck ...

BMW540 · Post by **BMW540** » Sun Feb 10, 2013 9:45 pm

Thanks to Ade, I got this buying guide
http://bmw540.eu/B10V8E39.pdf

I think it can be of help to you.

You might get some more answers if you add "B10 V8" to the headline of this thread.

MrD · Post by **MrD** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:30 am

paulbraden2010 - Thanks - I've added that lot to the growing list of things to look out for...
jamesa - I've done a fair bit of reading up, but then again, there's a fair bit to learn! I'll do my worst and go see the car, then probaly arrange a professional inspection if I think the car is worth pursuing.
BMW540 - Thanks for that, I did just go and buy the back issue before seeing your post

BarryM - Thanks again, great advice

I'm after a Touring, which limits the choices quite a lot. I'd probably be equally happy with a 3.3, which anyway seems to have 'better' steering - rack vs recirculating ball - but there seem to actually be fewer of those around.

So far, this is what's out there, though if you find any more, do tell

B10 V8 touring #178 - Lancashire so +3hrs away...
B10 V8 touring #116 - Near Nottingham, <1hr
B10 3.2 touring #64 - This one has had some discussion on here I think, not all of it entirely complementary, plus it's the 1st edition 3.2 so older, less wrinkles ironed out of it...
No privacy glass, no sunroof, only one of them has roof rails... but hey at least there's a phone installed! Would love to hear from anyone who has some knowledge of these cars. Some pics on the register, but not much else. The 2nd one is of most immediate interest, having the low mileage, but I still need some history to put that in context.

I think it was BarryM who put a price on the annual servicing/maintenance/repair at ~Â£2k which I presume is via garage service, rather than DIY. Is that typical?

So far, it seems the following should be checked
High cost and / or Serious consequences:-
Head Gasket
Cooling system
Control arms/Bushes
Sensors - lambda, MAF, camshaft position, O2
Diff seals

Condition/Finish/Consumables
Rust? If so, where?
Wheels/Tyres
Discs/Pads
Shutlines - any issues?
Pixels
Exhaust - not seen any comments - do they last forever?
Electrical items working - heated/elec seats, windows, radio/CD...

Anyone care to add anything to that list?
Many thanks.

ALPB1033 · Post by **ALPB1033** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:33 am

Rust can be found where the bolt fixed the spoiler under the bootlid. The worst is the whole bootlid needs replacing.

The exhaust is stainless steel and supposes to last for the life time of the car. But sometime the welds between the parts may be gone need welding done again.

E24man · Post by **E24man** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:10 am

MrD · Post by **MrD** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:12 am

Thanks E24man, great input again.
It is a big car and I'm quite sure the V8 would show itself, it is smiles we're looking for after all

I take it you don't see much between the mileage of those 2 cars? 58k is still at the point where you wouldn't expect much to have gone wrong. At 114k you might well have. Am I to take it that in your view the driving habits, ownership and service history outweigh even the large difference in mileage of these 2?
I take your point re distance travelled, would have to rely on a remote inspection in the first instance I think.
Cheers.

Chas · Post by **Chas** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:58 am

MrD wrote:Am I to take it that in your view the driving habits, ownership and service history outweigh even the large difference in mileage of these 2?

I'd agree wholeheartedly on this one. A high-miler with good history, new wheel bearings, discs, cooling system, and possibly head-gasket, will be a much better bet than a low-miler with a poor service record and all of those things about to fail. Those are the two extremes, of course. Aside from bodywork/interior, the condition of items which last circa 60k miles is the key to overall mechanical condition.

Andrew's (Jamesa) V8 Tourer is a great example of a 150k mile car which would put many 60k mile cars to shame.

ALPB1033 · Post by **ALPB1033** » Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:56 am

The other thing will go wrong is the ASC/DSC module. Usually the pump control it will go at the same time. A new replacement for both items are around Â£800 and Â£400 (vat extra) for module and pump restectively.

However the module can be repaired around Â£300. So daily drive can turn the system off.

Regarding the performance between the 4.6 and 3.3. The 3.3 is obviously slower than the 4.6 but still not far behind(be proven on Gaydon and Chas knew it as he was in the passenger seat once in the factory trip). The 4.6 will not run away as you expect and I think the 3.3 is much better than the 540i in all aspects.

The choice of 6 or 8 cylinder car depends on your head or heart. After owning mine for a few years, I nearly changed with a 4.6 or 4.8. But mine is a daily drive and maintenanice/running concerns, I keep it until now (9yrs) and still going strong.

jamesa · Post by **jamesa** » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:05 pm

Chas wrote:Andrew's (Jamesa) V8 Tourer is a great example of a 150k mile car which would put many 60k mile cars to shame.

Thanks Chas, I`m touched

... appreciation too to the previous owners (especially the last two) who were meticulous in looking after it