4/6/7 -Does Google have too much money / time on it's hands?

[neil]

Just looking at Google's new feature on their US website called Streetview...

LINK - click on the streetview button.

If you thought google maps (and Earth) were impressive, then street view literally takes it down to the street - you get a 3D photo view of selected cities in NA.

It begs the question of where will it end and also how much time/money must google have to do this ?

The fact that google still doesn't charge for any of its consumer products still amazes me and you wonder when or if this will end.

Knowledge is power and the earth certainly looks well and truely on its way to being googled.

Microsoft is doing similar map stuff (HERE).

What do you guys think ?

[Charles]

Last year Google made about $10billion - of which about 95% came from sponsored links and online advertising.

Not only does Google deliver its own advertising channel in the form of AdWords but it also syndicates this to other search engines.

I believe that Google is desperately trying to establish different revenue channels so that they are not completely dependent on advertising, but at this stage, they are offering new ideas for free until such time that they are proved/tested/acccepted. Then I am expecting to see Google licencing out the technology to third party suppliers in a syndicated way similar to online advertising.

What is interesting is that everyone cried foul when Micrsosoft packaged computers with Internet Explorer, but nowadays Firefox comes with Google as the default and if you load the Google toolbar and then try to change the default search engine for IE& awat from Google, the toolbar blocks this request until you confirm twice.

As such, why isn't Google getting hammered for anti-trust like Microsoft was?

Also, have any of you Google users ever asked yourself why you use it in the first place? Most people I know use it because they believe in the brand and not because the results are any better than any other search engine (they wouldn't know because they blindly use Google).

[v8 ego]

The MS stuff is actually quite old. The aerial shots for where my house is was done were takn before my garage was built in 2002.

[neil]

The MS stuff is actually quite old. The aerial shots for where my house is was done were takn before my garage was built in 2002.

Yeah The gerkin round the corner from my london office is also not more than foundations on there too.

Couple of other interesting Google developments.

adsense for maps -> Here

and another map tie up -> Here

[Ian J]

have any of you Google users ever asked yourself why you use it in the first place? .

I use Google as it paid for my Alpina

My website is rated in the top two or three on Google, Yahoo and MSN but I can see from the tracker that 90% of the traffic comes via Google

[Charles]

have any of you Google users ever asked yourself why you use it in the first place? .

I use Google as it paid for my Alpina

My website is rated in the top two or three on Google, Yahoo and MSN but I can see from the tracker that 90% of the traffic comes via Google

But why do YOU use Google? Sure, the traffic from Google is good for you and your website is well placed, but why do you choose Google as your search engine?

As an example, the website for one of my businesses is well optimised and appears at the top of the first page on all four "big ones", but I don't use Google for my searches. I actually use ClickNow - www.clicknow.org.uk - which allows me to search as normal AND raise money for my chosen charity at the same time. It presents the results in both Ask and Google formats and is clean and simple to use. Sometimes I cannot find what I want and so revert back to Google or Yahoo, but most of the time it gives me the answers to my questions.

To answer my own question, I would venture to suggest that most people use Google out of habit rather than based on a detailed rational assessment of which product delivers the service the way they want it. We would do this when researching a new car or television - why don't we do this when choosing a search engine to use?

[Ian J]

I actually use ClickNow - www.clicknow.org.uk - which allows me to search as normal AND raise money for my chosen charity at the same time.

I'd never heard of that one but having checked it out I like it a lot as it rates my sites very well. I'll try it out for a while

[Chas]

I would venture to suggest that most people use Google out of habit rather than based on a detailed rational assessment of which product delivers the service the way they want it.

The same goes for Microsoft and is down to being in the right place at the right time. Once something like Google gains momentum, success becomes a self fulfilling prophesy. The bigger they get, the more power they have. Nothing can compete.

[Charles]

I actually use ClickNow - www.clicknow.org.uk - which allows me to search as normal AND raise money for my chosen charity at the same time.

I'd never heard of that one but having checked it out I like it a lot as it rates my sites very well. I'll try it out for a while

Glad you like it - it's my company!

Sorry for the advertising but it is for chariteeeeeee

[nealpina]

Charles, I have added your site to my favourites and also forwarded it to people at work and as well as family and friends.

I am currently preparing for some exams and therefore my tone is harsh. When companies do tests with search engines Google beats all the others with how refined their searches are. Google source code is known as open GL (I believe) therefore if they use any coding from the public domain this will be put back into the public domain for free – therefore it is a community. IMO Google are developing ideas that are floating about from cyberspace and are just developing them for everyone’s enjoyment. As it is free and is also one of the best search engines therefore I do not have a problem with them making money from advertisements or developing ideas.

Regarding the anti trusts: I think Firefox will argue that IE and Outlook are pre-installed with the operating system. Firefox is installed out of someone’s free choice. However it then brings another argument: Safari (Apple’s version of IE) and Linux versions of IE are pre-installed but no-one has sued Apple or Linux! Another point is, it is easy to uninstall Firefox but it is hassle to remove IE and Outlook Express from windows. Also you can download Firefox without the Google toolbar included therefore if someone wants this toolbar it is once again a user’s free choice.

[rcshott]

Charles, I have added your site to my favourites and also forwarded it to people at work and as well as family and friends.

Me ditto, well done Charles
Jim

[Richy_Boy]

OpenGL is a graphics engine code format... i.e. 3D graphics like Direct3D.

I think you probably means Open Source which, as long as it adheres to a standard usage agreement (GPL etc) then it FORCES the benefiter of open source code to release any developments they have made to improve it, back to the community.

i.e. as many home devices now have a micro-kernel developed from a linux, unix system they have to release their firmware / software back on the internet for all to see, use and modify. It's a wonderful idea... Most companies bury this in the back of their website somewhere though - they don't have to promote it at all.

One of the key differences between the Microsoft / Google thing is that of course IE was the default browser for all their operating systems, and of course used MSN as their search engine by default. Each 'business' was generating money. They then claimed that IE was embedded into Windows and couldn't possibly remove it as they integrated the browser into the 'explorer' part of the operating system.

Google merely supplies the search engine, not the browser or the operating system - so there is no conflict of interest between the 'layers' of software.

Macs use Safari, but Apple don't default you to an Apple search engine or stop you from uninstalling Safari and use an alternative product. Same with Linux... it comes with Firefox (which itself is defaulted to Google) but you can use a whole host of other browsers - uninstalling firefox is as easy as uninstalling any other application. This can't be said about IE and Windows!

The reason why google is so good it due to what it does behind the scenes. The spidering (searching) it does through the internet to create the listings is simply awesome - by far the best out there in my opinion. Not only that, but you're not smothered in images and advertising that isn't relevant to your search.. like with MSN, for example which provides more of a portal experience.

As Google don't necessarily worry about generating money from all their projects it allows them to be much more experimental. i.e. they now have an online office application, which allows you to create and edit spreadsheets, word processing etc at no cost. If they haven't already, they'll integrate this with user accounts so you can save your work online - enabling you to retrieve your files anywhere you have an internet connection (i.e. computer, phone, playstation 3 etc). MS will soon be moving this direction, except will 'hire' you out an online system to generate funds, rather than relying on advertising like Google will have to.

Anyway, that's my two bob on this topic - you could never guess what field I work in!

Rich

[nealpina]

Rich, I don’t fully agree with some of your points, hope you don’t mind me commenting . Also I hope no one minds me being too technical or too boring

OpenGL is a graphics engine code format... i.e. 3D graphics like Direct3D.

I think you probably means Open Source which, as long as it adheres to a standard usage agreement (GPL etc) then it FORCES the benefiter of open source code to release any developments they have made to improve it, back to the community.

I actually meant ‘OpenSocial’

One of the key differences between the Microsoft / Google thing is that of course IE was the default browser for all their operating systems, and of course used MSN as their search engine by default. Each 'business' was generating money. They then claimed that IE was embedded into Windows and couldn't possibly remove it as they integrated the browser into the 'explorer' part of the operating system.

Google merely supplies the search engine, not the browser or the operating system - so there is no conflict of interest between the 'layers' of software.

Macs use Safari, but Apple don't default you to an Apple search engine or stop you from uninstalling Safari and use an alternative product. Same with Linux... it comes with Firefox (which itself is defaulted to Google) but you can use a whole host of other browsers - uninstalling firefox is as easy

I think it is a good thing that it is not easy to uninstall IE! Microsoft was forced to have warnings for not having anti spyware/virus applications installed on a user's computer. As people were saying to them: “You never told me that I needed to have an Anti Virus application, hence it is your fault to why my data is now corrupted/damaged!” The people that use Windows that are unaware that they need an Anti Virus application will moan even more at Microsoft if they accidently uninstall IE, hence to why I consider it to be a good thing that it is somewhat difficult to uninstall for the novice. Microsoft have made it is easy to set alternative programmes to open as default, therefore I think that is a good compromise.

Most people that use Apple admire the robustness and looks of the hardware and the fact that it has an OEM setup install, also that it is on a Linux platform. Safari search bar is Google! IMO most Mac users will never stop using or uninstall Safari because this is one of the major buying points of a Mac.

Linux users are people that are programmers, developers, security experts etc. Therefore they can do mostly anything on a computer. Linux users find Windows to be more of hindrance because of their acquired knowledge.

Businesses tend to use a mixture of everything because of the reasons outlined above.

The reason why google is so good it due to what it does behind the scenes. The spidering (searching) it does through the internet to create the listings is simply awesome - by far the best out there in my opinion. Not only that, but you're not smothered in images and advertising that isn't relevant to your search.. like with MSN, for example which provides more of a portal experience.

I agree that the spider affect is what makes the searches excellent with Google and this is due to web developers writing in a certain industry standard code which is called CSS

As Google don't necessarily worry about generating money from all their projects it allows them to be much more experimental. i.e. they now have an online office application, which allows you to create and edit spreadsheets, word processing etc at no cost. If they haven't already, they'll integrate this with user accounts so you can save your work online - enabling you to retrieve your files anywhere you have an internet connection (i.e. computer, phone, playstation 3 etc). MS will soon be moving this direction, except will 'hire' you out an online system to generate funds, rather than relying on advertising like Google will have to.

Keeping documents on a Google or a Microsoft sever. I personally don’t think this is a good idea because if someone guesses someone’s password then the amount of data that they will be able to view is worrying! I need to have a msn account mainly for one reason but I do use it for another one as well, both of these are not to send or receive e-mails. In the last two months there have been two massive viruses being passed via MSN massager. Therefore I don’t trust MSN for this reason and also the fact that Google logs every web search which someone makes. I am not bothered and most people shouldn’t be bothered if Google log your web searches but it is still a form of anti-privacy and if they have the power to do this. Will their terms and conditions allow them to view and read your files!

Another fact is every parent that allows their children to use Google are in fact breaking the law. Google’s terms and conditions say you can only search on Google if you’re above 18 years of age

[Richy_Boy]

No problem with a differing of opinion, it's what makes the world go around!

A few quick points I'd like to make (very quick as I have just lost my long version by hitting the 'right-arrow' on my laptop - doh!)

- OpenSocial - ahh. A bit like OpenSource but with Google supplying the well written code to the community instead of the other way around! A great idea...

- It would be very simple for MS to have a drop down with alternative browser options during the install time - but they blindly bundle IE, Messenger, Outlook, Media Player plus a whole load more for free with their software - killing any financially based competitor instantly. This is why ONLY open source or companies or those that rely on advertising can survive now.

On a side note it would also be simple to MS to default the timezone based on what country you specify your in (with keyboard settings to).. after several generations of software they STILL can't do this, thus it defaults to $ and US keyboard layouts - ugh!

- Lets face it, MS practically invented the modern virus - no other system on the market relies so heavily on a firewall and antivirus software to 'work'. It's purely down to bad design for many years which has led to this mess - I have never had to install an antivirus application on my home Linux machine, it's simply been designed better.

For MS to now have the cheek to start selling antivirus products, or even worse, providing them for free with Windows is an utter disgrace IMO - talk about irony.

- Businesses tend to be saturated by Windows to be honest, purely due to being shipped wiht any PC they try and buy. Over generations this has built up into a requirement for businesses to work i.e. to integrate with Active Directory. If way back in the beginning there were 2-3 major operating systems out there and the user had to pay extra money to put either one on, Windows would either be significantly cheaper by now (i.e. £50) or there would be a much more even spread in the market place. Who would continue to buy Windows with their own money if it's riddled by security problem?!

Only recently have people started to ask why they HAVE to pay for another license of Windows for their new machine, when they have already bought one.

- CSS or stylesheets offer a quick way of wrapping a website in a design (i.e. look and feel). IMO they don't offer much in the way of helping Google rank it - bar naming conventions. Google is a clever beast and relies not only on keywords, but website content, hits, image names, folder names etc - there's a whole topic on tuning your site for Google which frankly I don't know enough enough about. That's why SEO (Search Engine Optimisation) companies are making good money as they understand this process and can manipulate it so you end up higher up the list than [without SEO] you 'should'.

- Web based applications are coming whether people like it or not, it's the ONLY way companies like MS can keep making profits (i.e. lease you a license of office instead of selling it to you). Nowadays OS and application writers seem to tinker with the tool, rather than make major changes so people are going to stop paying for upgrades (take Vista and Office 2007 to example). XP and 2003 did the job perfectly well (bar the security issues built into XP) - so why pay hundreds of pounds every few years? If they lease it to you it's a monthly/annual fee for ever!

As for your personal data being held on the web.. it's not so scary with modern encryption techniques - it's probably safer there (i.e. from prying eyes and data recovery purposes) than on your home or work laptop, especially if like most machines they come with a BLANK default administrator password!

i.e. type: "\\enter-your-machines-ip-address\c$" into your explorer windows on another machine on your home network and see what happens! (normally free and complete access to all content on the remote machine!)

Without a firewall in place ALL internet users, or anyone with access to your unlocked wireless connection also has this access ability.

Sure Google logs your searches, this is partly due to the way it works by tuning your results to previous interests. i.e. if I searched for car stuff all day long and then typed in 'plug' - it would be weighted to 'car plugs' rather than 'electrical plugs'.

More worrying is the fact your ISP logs this data and will spool it's logs off to the nearest policeman on request from the courts. Not a problem in itself, but if you've been hit by pop-ups that throw images of naked young ladies on your screen - you're in trouble! Of course, lets not forget your browser caches any images locally and IE, even though you have told it to delete all the cache, still keeps a copy deep in your profile (nice!).

On a slow day, you might want to take a read of the Microsoft EULA (user agreement) which says MS is allowed to scan your computer / data any time it wants to... and you can't do and won't know anything about it. Now that's a worrying development!

Anyway, this short version has rattled on for far too long I best do some work!

Rich

[nealpina]

As for your personal data being held on the web.. it's not so scary with modern encryption techniques - it's probably safer there (i.e. from prying eyes and data recovery purposes) than on your home or work laptop, especially if like most machines they come with a BLANK default administrator password!

i.e. type: "\\enter-your-machines-ip-address\c$" into your explorer windows on another machine on your home network and see what happens! (normally free and complete access to all content on the remote machine!)

C$ only works if you’re an authentic user. I also take that to mean that you have not used Vista yet as you need to enable C$

- Businesses tend to be saturated by Windows to be honest, purely due to being shipped wiht any PC they try and buy. Over generations this has built up into a requirement for businesses to work i.e. to integrate with Active Directory. If way back in the beginning there were 2-3 major operating systems out there and the user had to pay extra money to put either one on, Windows would either be significantly cheaper by now (i.e. £50) or there would be a much more even spread in the market place. Who would continue to buy Windows with their own money if it's riddled by security problem?!

Only recently have people started to ask why they HAVE to pay for another license of Windows for their new machine, when they have already bought one.

&

As for your personal data being held on the web.. it's not so scary with modern encryption techniques - it's probably safer there (i.e. from prying eyes and data recovery purposes) than on your home or work laptop, especially if like most machines they come with a BLANK default administrator password!

All large corporations have volume licences for Microsoft software. I have a deep understanding of encryption protocols e.g. IPSec and SSL. What concerns me is the integrity of the administrators that are maintaining these servers and networks.

Blank passwords are the fault of either the home user, or the company’s IT administrator/department. The OEM and retail setup explains that a password is a good idea, and companies that leave blank passwords for the Administrator accounts will fail most audits.

On a slow day, you might want to take a read of the Microsoft EULA (user agreement) which says MS is allowed to scan your computer / data any time it wants to... and you can't do and won't know anything about it. Now that's a worrying development!

Microsoft only scans and logs your computer if there is a licensing issue, such as, it has not passed the Windows Genuine Advantage.